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Post by Gillian Laird on Jun 1, 2024 17:38:04 GMT
"'You have youth, confidence, and a job,' the older waiter said. 'You have everything'" (Hemingway 2).
I am still trying to piece together my thoughts on "A Clean, Well-Lighted Place," however I can easily say this is my favorite reading from the week. What struck me immediately is when the two waiters are commenting on the drunk old man and his attempted suicide. They remark on how he must have been in false despair because he is wealthy. They continue speaking of him like this until he leaves; they eventually turn on each other. They begin comparing their own lives as if they are in competition to see who has it worse. I feel like this is related to existentialism in some way, but I am not well-versed enough on the subject to figure out how. Does anyone have any input?
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Post by meagangcurrie on Jun 1, 2024 18:10:38 GMT
To be completely honest, existentialism still somewhat baffles me. There are elements that I understand but the concept as a whole is still a puzzle. Regarding the waiters, I believe that, in a sense, they could be existentialist. They are both focused on their own lives and what means the most to them. I would say the older waiter, however, is probably more of an existentialist. He has lived longer, has had different experiences, and has a more aged perspective. Like you, I am still gathering my thoughts on the story so I cannot answer your question.
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Post by Dr. Nemmers on Jun 1, 2024 20:33:09 GMT
Appreciate this kick-off post, Gillian! A couple of things that I noticed:
1. The waiters seem to be foils for each other, not only in age but in attitude and temperament. I broached this in another thread but I think it's still worth exploring... If we had to characterize one as more quintessentially existentialist, it'd be the one who gives the Lord's prayer filled with nada (the elder, I believe). Will have more on this in another thread, I think.
2. Regarding despair, which is a very, very existentialist state of being, here's the relevant dialogue:
"Last week he tried to commit suicide," one waiter said.
"Why?"
"He was in despair."
"What about?"
"Nothing."
"How do you know it was nothing?"
"He has plenty of money."
This brings up one of the central conundrums of existentialist thought and being. The old man apparently attempted suicide, supposedly out of despair.
Was he in despair about nothing?
Or was there nothing that he was in despair about?
I suppose another way of reading this, in addition to Gillian's contention, is that the old man himself is an existentialist as well?
What do y'all think?
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Post by gillianlaird on Jun 3, 2024 20:18:40 GMT
Thank you for your response, Dr. Nemmers. What struck me the most about your response is the way you portray the old man in the story. When reading the story originally, my existentialist take had more to do with how the waiters appeared to diminish his right to sadness solely because of his wealth. They seem to incline that abundant wealth inherently relates to happiness. However, I did not think to more closely inspect the old man himself (which I suppose makes me a lot more like the two waiter characters that I originally thought). The idea that the old man might have attempted either out of despair or a lack of despair is very interesting. That opens the existentialist doorway to a very interesting question: is it better to feel deep sadness or nothing at all? I'm of the opinion that, as humans, we are meant to feel everything, good and bad. The real horrors of life are not depression, loneliness, anger, etc. It is numbness. When looking at the short story through this lens, I believe the old man might have felt (or in this case, not felt) the latter.
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